Legendary Pokémon

I´m sorry if I am spamming, but, did you know that 1 / 0 = Infinite?

Just think like this... the result of a division is as big as the denominator is small (in modulus, like -1 = 1 in modulus - I don´t know if the word "modulus" is the right one in english... at least, it is in portuguese). For example:
1 / 0,1 = 10
1 / 0,01 = 100
1 / 0,001 = 1000

Well, the smallest number in modulus is zero. So, anything divided by zero would be the biggest number... which is infinite.

Some interesting note: even computers think like this. If you try to divide 1 for 0, in some programming languages, the result would be Infinite.

either it would equal that, or it would equal...nothing. So MUCH nothing, that it just errors it.

(11-06-2011 02:53 PM)Aluado Wrote: [ -> ]I´m sorry if I am spamming, but, did you know that 1 / 0 = Infinite?

Just think like this... the result of a division is as big as the denominator is small (in modulus, like -1 = 1 in modulus - I don´t know if the word "modulus" is the right one in english... at least, it is in portuguese). For example:
1 / 0,1 = 10
1 / 0,01 = 100
1 / 0,001 = 1000

Well, the smallest number in modulus is zero. So, anything divided by zero would be the biggest number... which is infinite.

Some interesting note: even computers think like this. If you try to divide 1 for 0, in some programming languages, the result would be Infinite.

I don't think it goes like this. We learned a simple method in school, maths subject, to prove some things correct or wrong and here is what happens if we try it on your idea.

Let's suppose that:

1/0=infinite

So since this is a simple equation, it can also be transformed to this:

infinite*0=1

But the above is wrong since everything, including infinite, will be nullified once multiplied with zero. Since the above is wrong, the first statement is also wrong.


You know, dividing by zero is impossible because it can't occur in our world. It's unnatural, if we try to do this in physics or maths we will get weird results that are just too extreme or practically impossible.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZoc25HDFBQ
what happens when you divide by zero...

Nice! It had been a long time since I´ve discussed anything and I like it! so I´m replying now, hehe.

Well, actually, you learn about operations like the one I´ve told you only in the university. I also thought it was quite illogic, but that the ways it goes.

(11-06-2011 08:32 PM)Divided by Zer0 Wrote: [ -> ]Let's suppose that:

1/0=infinite

So since this is a simple equation, it can also be transformed to this:

infinite*0=1

But the above is wrong since everything, including infinite, will be nullified once multiplied with zero. Since the above is wrong, the first statement is also wrong.

Actually, mathmatically talking, Infinite is a "special" value, not really an ordinary number. Operations with Infinite doesn´t go the normal way we are used to.

Like:
Infinite + anything (even Infinite) = Infinite
Infinte * anything (besides 0) = Infinite
Infinite - anything (besides Infinite) = Infinite
Infinite / anything (besides Infinite or 0) = Infinite

Infinite - Infinite = Impossible to do
Infinite * 0 = Impossible to do
Infinite / Infinite = Impossible to do
Infinite / 0 = Impossible to do

When I say that it´s "impossible to do", it means that it can be any value (even 1... so, Infinite * 0 can be = 1 or anything else), but we can´t know which one... Infinite is the only term whose multiplication by zero is not necessarily equal to zero. Why? I don´t know either lol (I´ve studied it in university 2 years ago, so I don´t remember everything), but that´s the way it is.

Hum... maybe I could explain like this:
- 5 / 0 = Infinite
- Infinite * 0 = 5
- 1 / 0 = Infinite
- Infinite * 0 = 1
- 3 / 0 = Infinite
- Infinite * 0 = 3

Well, the division operations are true. The multiplication ones can be true, since we can´t really know the results of Infinite * 0, because it can be anything.

(11-06-2011 08:32 PM)Divided by Zer0 Wrote: [ -> ]You know, dividing by zero is impossible because it can't occur in our world. It's unnatural, if we try to do this in physics or maths we will get weird results that are just too extreme or practically impossible

Actually... in some situations, like in programming (I´m a programmer, by the way), division by zero can occur. For instance, if you are using a variable as the denominator of some division and, in some moment, its value is zero. In some systems, an error will occur and it will crash. In other systems, the value of the operation will be the highest possible value (which could be interpreted as Infinite).

By the way, as I said, I´m a programmer, so I´m explaining this stuff by the programming view. I don´t know if Infinite has other meanings or uses in other point of views (like in physics or maths).

Sorry for my imperfect english, but I hope I could explain it well. I´d try to search something about it in the Internet, so I could have something to "proof" that I´m not lying, hehe, but I need to go now...

It may be possible it other scientific fields but I don't think it's something achievable in classic algebra or physics. In programming it's probably based on the programming language u use. After all programs and their languages are made by humans so they can't resemble the natural, correct solution. And if you think it logically, dividing is like having an a amount of things and giving it to a b number "persons", let's say. So if you have 1 apple and you give it to 1 kid, every kid will get 1 apple. If you have 1 apple and you give it to 0 kids, how many apples will every kid have? But, there aren't any kids at all, how the hell are they supposed to get any apples? It's like wanting to give something to someone but there aren't any other people at all. It's like sharing something to nothing.

How ironic, Divided by Zer0 trying to prove that division by zero is impossible .

I've calculated stuff, and apparently, the average number of habitable planets in the universe is zero. Why is that? Well, lets see.

Our universe has an infinite number of worlds, because it is infinitely big

However, not every one of these worlds is inhabited. Therefore, there is a finite number of inhabited worlds.

To get the average, you must divide that number by infinity. THIS my friends, is where things get dicey. While it won't make exactly zero, any finite number that is divided by infinity will equal a number so small and close to zero that it defies our logic. Therefore, through rounding, the average number of habitable planets in the universe is effectively zero.

(11-06-2011 11:00 PM)GeorgeSlayer Wrote: [ -> ]How ironic, Divided by Zer0 trying to prove that division by zero is impossible .

I have to defend my nickname. If division by zero is proven possible, it will lose its charm.

(11-06-2011 11:00 PM)Giratina88 Wrote: [ -> ]I've calculated stuff, and apparently, the average number of habitable planets in the universe is zero. Why is that? Well, lets see.

Our universe has an infinite number of worlds, because it is infinitely big

However, not every one of these worlds is inhabited. Therefore, there is a finite number of inhabited worlds.

To get the average, you must divide that number by infinity. THIS my friends, is where things get dicey. While it won't make exactly zero, any finite number that is divided by infinity will equal a number so small and close to zero that it defies our logic. Therefore, through rounding, the average number of habitable planets in the universe is effectively zero.

There must be a mistake to your calculations. There's at least one habitable planet, aka Earth, while some others claim that the number of inhabited planets is huge, like the one that shows how many advanced civilizations exist out there.

Iirc, in algebra it can be proven that division by zero is impossible. We know that for every x≠0, x/x=1. Assuming division by 0 is possible, 0/0=1. If a≠b, we know 0*a=0 and 0*b=0 → 0*a=0*b. Since we assumed it is possible, (0*a)/0=(0*b)/0 → (0/0)*a=(0/0)*b → a=b which isn't correct.

In calculus, we use limits to show that dividing by a number that approaches 0 has a result that approaches infinity. Db0, you'll learn these things in about a year and a half.

(12-06-2011 12:48 AM)Divided by Zer0 Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-06-2011 11:00 PM)Giratina88 Wrote: [ -> ]I've calculated stuff, and apparently, the average number of habitable planets in the universe is zero. Why is that? Well, lets see.

Our universe has an infinite number of worlds, because it is infinitely big

However, not every one of these worlds is inhabited. Therefore, there is a finite number of inhabited worlds.

To get the average, you must divide that number by infinity. THIS my friends, is where things get dicey. While it won't make exactly zero, any finite number that is divided by infinity will equal a number so small and close to zero that it defies our logic. Therefore, through rounding, the average number of habitable planets in the universe is effectively zero.

There must be a mistake to your calculations. There's at least one habitable planet, aka Earth, while some others claim that the number of inhabited planets is huge, like the one that shows how many advanced civilizations exist out there.

I said AVERAGE, not total number.

Ok, I admit that there's still much to consider before claiming that division by zero is impossible. So I give up, at least for now. I guess I will learn more on this topic in a few years, like Ninjomewtwo said.

What Ninjomewtwo said is what I was trying to say... using "limits", division by zero is possible. I just didn´t know how to express this idea in english, lol

But, I´d like to share with you a real application of division by zero. I´ll try to explain it... because it´s really hard for me to express such concepts in a foreign language.

Well, in physics, when we learn about electricity, we learn Ohm´s law, right? The formula is:

P = V * i

Where P is the power in watts, V is the voltage across the resistor and i the current through it. Well according to this formula, you can also calculate the value of the current:

i = P / V

Ok, so, now tell me: what would happen if your circuit have no resistors at all? V value would be zero. Well, in real life, if you do something like this, a short circuit would happen. Why, you ask? Because the current is just too high! Mathematically talking, its value would be infinite.

Well, now, let´s use the short circuit example in the other formula:

P = V * i

In a short circuit, the value of i is Infinite. P, the value of the power, which could be anything (let´s suppose... 20, for an example) and V = 0. So, we have:

20 = Infinite * 0

If I used another value of P in this case, results would be the same. Let´s use 40 as the value of P this time:

40 = Infinite * 0

Maybe this "prooves" why Infinite * 0 can be anything, and Anything / 0 = Infinite.

^

Ok, I think there has been a misunderstanding. When I said "like Ninjomewtwo said" I was refering only to these words:

(12-06-2011 03:52 PM)Ninjomewtwo Wrote: [ -> ]Db0, you'll learn these things in about a year and a half.

Not the whole post. I mean that I lack knowledge on Maths etc to be fully able to further analyze on this topic


Apart from that, I understood your example. I have only one objection. Is it actually practically possible to create a circuit, even without resistors, that will allow current to pass freely, without any resistance? I mean that even in a short circuit, only the wires will cause a tiny reduction to current, preventing V from becoming absolute zero and i from reaching infinity.

If we suppose that it is possible in our world, then yes, I agree to the above. And it proves why infinite*0=anything, eventually why division by zero might be possible. But I think it's not. And such tiny diferences make divisions by zero practically impossible.


An example I can give based on Physics

We know that the formula of speed is this:

V=m/sec

Where V is speed, m the distance traveled and sec is the time needed to travel this distance. If we suppose that something travels a distance in 0 time, it actually means that it gains infinite speed.

infinite speed=any distance/0 time

Which can be turned to:

any distance=infinite speed*0 time

That is exactly the conclusion of your example (infinite*0=anything). BUT!

It may seem correct but it's not, since nothing can move faster than light, whose speed is not infinite (something like 300k m/sec). Infinite speed is not practically possible.



Concluding, what I want to say is:

There's no such thing as a realistic application of dividing by zero. It may be theoretically possible, but not actually.

That is true. While conceptually it makes sense, on a mathematical basis it doesn't work. If anything divided by zero makes infinity, then what is infinity multiplied by zero? Well, since anything multiplied by zero is zero, its the same thing with infinity. Let me graph it.

1/0 = infinity
infinity x 0 = 0

See? While it is conceptually possible, on a mathematical basis it contradicts itself. There is another problem I will graph.

1/0 = infinity
2/0 = infinity
1 = 2

Thus division by zero can't make infinity because it contradicts itself in many ways. It also can't make zero, because you can't multiply zero by zero to get your number again. So either path will end up messing up all sense of logic to the point of 2 + 2 equaling 10.